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Jewelry Crafting: Get ready for the worst grind in ESO's history

14 May 2018 11:27
Lonyn
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Jewelry Crafting: Get ready for the worst grind in ESO's history #116512
This has been taken from ESO forums written by Code 65536. But two of ESO members Gina Bruno and Rich Lambert have signed at the bottom.

Most players who regularly participate in the PTS or otherwise follow the PTS closely already know what will be in store for them when the Summerset update introduces jewelry crafting, but I suspect that most of the player base are not yet aware of some of the details of the system.

Specifically, the amount of materials needed to upgrade jewelry quality is 10x more than what is needed for the other crafts.

Similar to the other crafts, it takes 2 green plates, 3 blue plates, 4 purple plates, and 8 golden plates to upgrade jewelry if you have maxed the improvement passives. The problem is that whereas you acquire full pieces of upgrade materials for the other crafts, the upgrade materials for jewelry come in the form of grains, which represent 1/10th of a plate. And, most crucially, based on testing that people have done on the PTS, these grains drop at the same rate as the full upgrade materials of the other crafts.

For example, when you deconstruct a purple-quality staff with maxed deconstruction passives, you have a 50% chance of getting a single Mastic from the deconstruction. When you deconstruct a purple-quality ring with the necessary deconstruction passives, you have the same 50% chance of getting a single grain of a purple jewelry upgrade material. Each time you refine raw wood, you have a 7.5% chance to acquire a single Mastic--a full purple upgrade mat. Each time you refine raw jewelry mats, you have the same 7.5% chance to acquire a single grain of a purple jewelry upgrade material.

Effectively, the amount of materials needed to upgrade is 10x more than that of the other crafts, since the upgrade materials are acquired as 1/10th grains from all sources (refinement, deconstruction, and writ rewards; there are no hirelings), at rates that are apparently identical to that of full upgrade mats of other crafts.

What does this mean? It means that to craft a single purple-quality Julianos ring, you will need 20 green grains, 30 blue grains, and 40 purple grains. Purple mats--grains for jewelry and full upgrade mats for the other crafts--drop at a 7.5% rate per refinement. To acquire 40 grains, you will need to refine 533 times; you will need to acquire and refine approximately 5300 raw jewelry mats just to craft a single purple ring.

Let's say purple is too rich for your blood. You just want to craft a simple blue-quality Julianos ring. That's 30 blue grains, which, at a drop rate of 12.5% per refinement, is 240 refinements. You need to acquire and refine 2400 raw jewelry mats to craft a single blue Julianos ring.

What if you're leveling a character, and instead of wearing random dropped jewelry as you do now, you want to craft a matching set of jewelry? Since it's just a character that's being leveled, you're not too picky and will be happy with simple green quality. 20 grains at a 15% drop rate means 133 refinements. You need to acquire and refine 6-7 stacks of raw jewelry mats just to upgrade a single ring to green quality.

Still excited about jewelry crafting?

I have friends who were excited about all the golden jewelry from vet trials that they can decon for mats next patch. Similar to other crafts, with maxed passives, you have only a 50% chance of getting an upgrade mat from decon. Except here, it's just a grain. To acquire the 80 grains needed to upgrade a single purple ring to gold, you'll need an average of 160 gold rings to decon. Think about that for a moment. You need to decon 160 golden jewelry pieces... to upgrade a single jewelry piece. That's 80 runs of vAA HM to get the mats for golding one jewelry piece via decon. I don't know about you, but I'll probably go crazy before the 20th run.

Or, if you're crazy enough to seek golden quality through refinement, you're looking at 1600 refinements: 16K, or 80 full stacks, of raw jewelry mats. For a single jewelry piece.

Oh, and did I mention that there are no hirelings? I did, but let's reiterate that.

How's that excitement for jewelry crafting now?

There is an easy solution, though: increase the drop rate of grains. They currently drop at the same rate as full upgrade mats of other crafts. (50% per decon, 15% green per refinement, 12.5% blue per refinement, 7.5% purple per refinement, and 5% gold per refinement.) If, for example, deconstruction always guaranteed at least 1 grain, with the chance of sometimes getting multiple grains, the drop rate would still be substantially lower than that of the other crafts, but not quite as insane as it currently is on the PTS. As it stands, jewelry crafting isn't fun. It isn't accessible. And I don't see myself seriously using it any time this year.

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_RichLambert
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15 May 2018 13:02
Lonyn
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Jewelry Crafting: Get ready for the worst grind in ESO's history #116523
This post is from Carbonised on the ESO forums.

There have already been plenty of posts outlining the problem of jewelrycrafting, which primarily concerns the lack of upgrade mats/tempers, and their being split into 1/10th of full upgrade mats.

ZOS is already wedded to the idea of tempers split into parts, and it seems unlikely this will change significantly.

However, there is a small but elegant solution to this: look into the droprates of temper parts from refining raw jewelrycrafting mats. By upping the dropchance for all colours of upgrade mats, you can keep the current system as is, and still provide players with a crafting system that doesn't take as much time, effort and grind in order to make a green ring, as it does to make a gold piece of armor (which is almost the case right now, according to the testing that has been done).

I suggest giving green upgrade mat parts a much higher droprate from refining, blue a somewhat higher droprate, purple a moderate droprate boost and gold a small droprate increase.
If nothing is changed from PTS now to live, I strongly suggest that ZOS monitors the usage of the jewelrycrafting very, very closely in the immediate months to come, and adjust the droprate of upgrade mats from refining accordingly. Your math and server statistics will tell you if people actually bother to create green, blue, purple or even gold jewels through crafting, or if they simply forego it altogether and only use jewelrycrafting to transmute into new traits.

Since nothing has been changed regarding master writs for jewelrycrafting, I also strongly suggest you monitor if people actually bother to waste their upgrade mats for a meager amount of vouchers (which I sincerely doubt anyone will). Once again, server statistics will tell you in a few months that jewelrycrafting master writs need to award a much higher amount of vouchers than they currently do (which is still the case for the provisioning writs that require perfect roe).

Surely someone at your office must be able to track these things and ajust droprates accordingly along the way. ZOS unfortunately has a bad habit of leaving droprates as-is for things like furniture recipes and other sought-after items, despite large famines on at least some of the megaservers. I suggest ZOS keeps a closer eye out on droprates in general, for items such as recipes and now jewelrycrafting upgrade mats, and do adjustments accordingly along the way, instead of going half or even a full year between adressing droprates that are way too low.

Bear in mind that upgrade mats are also used in the new jewelrycrafting furniture recipes, which often call for 4 green or 3 blue full upgrade mats per item. This also emphasizes the need for temper droprates to be higher than the other crafts for jewelrycrafting, since you went with the unnecessary concept of 1/10th of temper parts instead of whole tempers.
Another way of helping out furniture crafters would be to look again at some of the jewelrycrafting recipes, and adjust them accordingly, for instance requiring 2 green tempers instead of 4 as it currently is, which still translates to 20 green upgrade mats instead of 40, when you compare them to other crafts.
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15 May 2018 13:06
Lonyn
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Jewelry Crafting: Get ready for the worst grind in ESO's history #116524
This is a positive post from Elephant 42 on the ESO forums.
Well I've never been one to avoid eating humble pie when I deserve to but it looks like I may have been slightly over zealous in my opposition to the jewellery upgrade mat situation.

I decided to do some final testing on the PTS with the penultimate patch before making a final decision about Summerset and herewith I share my results. I tested with a newly created L3 character and enabled each of the decon passives as soon as I possibly could. I also got the CP passive that increases inspiration by 20% before starting

To get from start to 50 took me 6 CP100 white + 6 CP150 white + 6 Green + 6 Blue + 321 purple + 6 gold, all the non-whites were CP160

These were the inspiration values for each colour at varying Jewellery levels:

White CP100 provided a constant 741 and CP150 gave a constant 999 from L10 all the way to L45 - didn't test after that.

L10 G=4024, B=4024, P=4024, Gd=4024
L22 G=9349, B=9349, P=9349, Gd=9349
L32 G=11874, B=13500, P=14710, Gd=14768
L40 G=11874, B=13500, P=14710, Gd=16744
L45 G=11874, B=13500, P=14710, Gd=16744

So my TLDR summary is that it will take somewhere between approx 310 and approx 400 items of CP160 and any colour better than white to max JC. The exact number will depend on the numbers of each colour used. The leveling process will be reasonably quick and painless IMHO. Of note is that there is no advantage to higher than green until you get to somewhere above level 22 so might as well hang on to blues and above until at least L22. Also of note is that the maximum difference between green and purple is only 24%.

I ended up with 182 purple grains which is roughly a 60% yield from decon. I did not decon enough of the other colours to get a reliable figure but I can't see green and blue being any worse. I suspect that nodes won't be where people get their upgrade mats from - I suspect it will be dolmens :/

It's possible that we may have overreacted to the grains situation - this might just be the reason that ZOS have done it this way given the guaranteed jewellery drop from dolmens.

Now as long as ZOS doesn't change anything between now and release we might not be too badly off - still gonna be a PITA to craft green and above set jewellery for lowbies but blue for max chars shouldn't be too onerous a grind. Purple is still gonna be a monumental grindfest but not as bad as having to only rely on nodes as there are a few places to get reliable purple jewellery in more "interesting" ways than grinding nodes. Upgrading to gold is still a far far distant dream for most of us...
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15 May 2018 19:01
Zaaroc
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Jewelry Crafting: Get ready for the worst grind in ESO's history #116532
Whilst the drop rate indeed needs some boosting, I'm one to argue that golden jewelry -should- be rare, and it'd be arguably one of the last pieces you'd ever gold out. Stat-wise, the increase isn't noticable, apart from the dopamine levels in the brain telling you otherwise. Blue jewelry can be used in basically any situation, without any large deficits to you or your group (talking about endgame vTrials). The only things that really matter are your weapons, and if you're feeling rich, your monster set if you're wearing any. The rest of your armour can easily be purple (not an issue for most crafters).

I know it's a weird sensation, of something being "not right" with a blue ring... But honestly, you can do great dps/tanking/healing in blue gear.

Anyway, I reckon that by the time there's a reasonable amount of 9 trait jewelry crafters, either the temper droprate will have been increased, or people will have found a way to obtain more gold jewelry more efficiently. Of all the PTS feedback they've received, this is arguably the biggest thing that should have their attention.
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